Benny Blanco is still in his 30s, but he’s an industry veteran who has worked with just about everybody in pop at this point. That list includes Billie Eilish, and Blanco actually collaborated with her, and Finneas, at the very start of their journey, as he explained on a new episode of Therapuss

The conversation got to Selena Gomez’s old show Wizards Of Waverly Place, and Blanco noted he knew the theme song because it inspired Eilish’s “Bad Guy.” Shane then asked if he had worked with Eilish before and he responded, “I worked with her when she was legit like 14 years old or something.”

When asked if the song was ever released, Blanco explained:

“No, no, no. We have the same lawyer, or we did have the same lawyer, and he was like, ‘There’s this kid Finneas who’s really good and he works with his little sister, and we rep them and we think they could be something.’ They have just signed to Interscope after that and then I was like, ‘Oh, I really like this song,’ and they hadn’t ever played a concert of anything and they were like ‘Oh, come over.’ Or I invited them over to work at my house before anything.

And then literally a week or so later, we went to their first concert ever at… I think it was at The Echo or something. And there was a hundred kids there and half of them were from the label, and then I went to her second show. I think her second show was at the El Rey, and I went to that. I went to her first eight shows and just saw it all happen from the beginning, and they don’t need my help at all.”

Watch the full interview above.